Transcript:Amoz Gibson/Speaking in Amherst, Mass 1976
| Speaking in Amherst, Mass (1976) by |
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[0:00] Alláh-u-Abhá. The Universal House of Justice has allowed me to bring to each and every one of you its very warmest greetings, and it's a great honor for me to do that. It's a great pleasure for me to meet with you and to talk with you, and to see you face to face and to shake your hands. And I'm going to try to take back to Universal House of Justice some of the spirit that I felt as I walked around this room and met each one of you. And some of the feeling that I have to be with you in this room, because there is in this room a unity of spirit, a unity of devotion, a unity of effort to better men's lives, not just our own, but for all of the society in this area, and for that matter for the entire world. Otherwise, we would not have accepted Bahá’u’lláh, because that is His purpose. And the message of Bahá’u’lláh, as you know, is so all-encompassing that from the very beginning of ‘Abdu’l-Bahá’s ministry, he began to break it down into parts that we call plans, and gave to the American Bahá’ís, indeed to the American nations, a great duty, a great honor, a great privilege.
[1:51] He said to them that they would be the torch bearers of the faith of Bahá’u’lláh. He gave to them a divine plan by which they would take the faith of Bahá’u’lláh throughout the world. He assigned them certain countries. He named them, islands of the sea, whole countries. And he gave them this honor because he saw in them the capacity to do what he was calling upon them to do. We must measure up to this expectation. We are destined to do it if we make the effort. And that's why I'm very happy to be here with you, because I see in your faces this kind of devotion, this kind of dedication to this cause. ‘Abdu’l-Bahá wrote these tablets of the divine plan, which he has asigned duties to the American Bahá’ís in a room about as large as the rectangle from the wall there to this pillar and to that wall, a small room lined very much like this room here, on top of a garage. And I have been in that room, it is now used as one of the offices for a man who works in the research department. In that room there's a certain feeling. To the ordinary eye, to the non-Bahá’í it probably looks like a very insignificant room. But to the American Bahá’í community, that must be very special, because it was in that room that ‘Abdu’l-Bahá received this inspiration to give this plan to the Americans. Now this plan was given near the end of the Ministry of ‘Abdu’l-Bahá. For almost 20 years the Bahá’ís read the plan and they didn't do much about it. Some very wonderful valiant souls like Martha Root, Mary and Jack, May Maxwell and I'm naming all women I don't know why, [laughter], but there were also men. We believe in equality. Some very valiant souls went out in those days to various countries of the world. And they had a very great effect of sowing the seed, but there was not the administrative order to reap the harvest.
[5:19] Today we have that, we have the administrative order. We have local and national assemblies in every country in the world. Today the plan calls for the same type of individual: one whose valiant, dedicated, devoted to the service, brave, long suffering, long suffering [laughter]. Today as the Guardian said after a number of his own plans to each one a small portion of accomplishment of the Divine plan. Today we are in that period of the second plan given to the world by the Universal House of Justice. The Guardian said that the Universal House of Justice would give a series of teaching plans. In this great phase of the Bahá’í faith that's what it's all about. It's teaching the world of humanity that Bahá’u’lláh has come. All of our efforts should be toward teaching. And the teaching is not only attracting new souls to the faith. It is not only deepening those new souls, but it's also teaching ourselves. We must become deepened in our knowledge of the faith so that it is easier for us to live the Bahá’í life. We must know what it is to be a Bahá’í. We must live so that we are attractive to non-Bahá’ís. But they must see some difference in us. And I look right up and I look at a wonderful lady who's not yet a Bahá’í, so I know that she knows that I am talking to the Bahá’ís and to her because she is very close. But we Bahá’ís don't think that we are especially different by nature, by our own effort from the non-Bahá’í. But because we have been awakened to the Cause of God for this day, to the plan of God for this day, we should be a different people. Certainly the early Christians must have been different from the people around them. And the Jews were certainly a great deal different from the people who believed in many gods before them. And the followers of Islam certainly were different from the people who hadn't heard of the fact that there was one God and you should obey Him and all the wondrous laws that Muhammad taught them. So we must be different. We are different because we are in tune with what God is planned for the entire planet for this age. We are not perfect, not a single one of us. ‘Abdu’l-Bahá says We should be perfect people, and that must be sometime in the future [laughter]. In fact, some of the older Bahá’ís never say that they are Bahá’ís yet. They say: I'm a believer. And it's a wonderful statement because they are aware of the growth that they must make.
[9:25] Now the reason I said we must study so that we know what the Bahá’í faith is and what is expected of us, so that we can be this example, is because our lives, our very beings should be attractors, should be teachers. Beyond that, for goodness sakes, remember that the time has passed when we can teach by example alone and in silence. We must tell people about the Bahá’í Faith, we must invite them to come and see what it is we are trying to build in the world. Not because of our own wondrous nature, but because of what Bahá’u’lláh has given to us.
[10:20] We must see in the eyes of those that we meet a certain spark. We must see a spark that we can recognize as the spark of a true seeker, as the spark of the one who is searching. The Guardian said that if we develop ourselves, we can do this. I have seen it twice in the three days I've been here. Maybe I am wrong, I will say I think I have seen it, and I want to write back to this community and ask later if I have seen [laughter muffling a few words of speech]. You see, because I am a bit rusty. You who live in this wonderful free country where there's no restrictions on what you can do, and maybe that's why you don't do so much [laughter]. But their really are no restrictions in comparison to what you have in other places. There's so many opportunities, you who live in this wonderful free country have no idea what it is to live in a place where there are restrictions. Trom the days of Bahá’u’lláh, the Bahá’í faith was not taught in Palestine, in the Holy Land, in the country of Israel, and it was not taught, and it has not been taught any of this time, and it is not taught there today. To be in a place for 13 years like I have been, where you cannot teach your neighbor who is interested! The Jewish people are interested. They have even said to me some of my friends, "you don't accept Jews". It is heartbreaking you know. So we tell them about faith like you tell him about a new book you've read, about a movie you've seen, but just give the information without the spirit of love, because you're afraid to give the spirit of love, you will attract them. Then you have to tell them no. But you in this country, you can teach with all of the spirit, the knowledge and the spirit which will attract people. You must avail yourselves of this opportunity because you don't know where you will be all of your lives. You might yourselves end up in some country where you cannot teach the faith. And teaching is it. Teaching is the entire life of a Bahá’í. He's teaching by the way he's living, by the example. When he's praying he should be thinking of finding this coming day, this morning when he's saying his prayers he should be thinking of finding during this day the gleam in the eye of some person that he will tell about to Faith. The gleam that he knows will be enkindled into a flame of interest. Maybe not that same day, maybe not that same week. Maybe even he will not see the fruit of his effort, but he has planted that seed in the proper place.
[14:21] Our individual efforts then must be also related to the community effort I told you that in the days of ‘Abdu’l-Bahá and before that in the days of Bahá’u’lláh, there were a few very outstanding individuals who went far and wide. They did not have the assistance, the support, the backup , the assurance of being in a community where there were others who were working with them. And the important thing is with them. Individual effort is the basis, but the strength is in the unity of the community. The absolute strength that gives not only support, but gives a grace and a dignity to the effort of the individual is in the unity of the community. And when I attended my first feast yesterday in two years, I felt this unity in the community of [?]. And I know in the room today there those from other communities, and I'm sure that you have that same spirit in those communities. I have known of this area of Massachusetts for a long time, but it's in the last 15 years, maybe that last 10 years, that there has been such a vibrant Baháʼí community, so much so that when I was here in 74 they talked about the Pioneer Valley and I thought they called it a pioneer because the Baháʼís were here [laughter]. No really! [laughter] You know, because, you know, we use the word pioneer to mean a Baháʼí teacher who leaves his home to go to another place to teach the Faith, and I thought that the Baháʼís had named it the Pioneer Valley because they had come here for that. And I learned that this has been a Pioneer Valley for what's almost three centuries, you know, from the early days of the settlement of the British here in this country, in this continent.
But I am saying now that you individually will gear your efforts to the plan that's given to you by your local assembly. The plan that you have had a part in making because when you come to the feast, you will give your ideas to the local assembly, maybe you have to give them more than once or twice before they listen. But anyhow, you will give your ideas, and they will then devise a plan on the ideas and the recommendations that you make at the feast. So the plan is yours. It's already a part of you: your individual efforts, your firesides, your - what do you call them? Coffees, and your coffee klatches, is that word you use? And tête-à-têtes with your Baháʼí contacts, should be always, should always have the purpose of furthering the plan of the community. Your local community-- now, listen. Your local communities' plans should be good so that they further the plan of the National Assembly. The National Assembly has a plan to increase the number of assemblies throughout the country, to increase the number of groups throughout the country, to increase the number of localities in which Baháʼís live, so they will be calling upon you in your unified community to arise, to go to another place to begin a new unit of the Baháʼí Faith, a locality, open a new locality, establish a new group, create a new assembly. Think what a blessing Bahá’u’lláh has given us. He has allowed us to have a part in bringing to being the institutions he created. We have a part in bringing into being the Local Spiritual Assemblies which are created by Bahá’u’lláh in the Kitáb-i-Aqdas, the Most Holy Book, and we can have a part of that. We gear ourselves to our local plans, and the plans of the local community are geared to the national effort, to the national plans. And in this room, there are several who have been on National Spiritual Assemblies, and they know that the National Spiritual Assemblies must gear their annual plans to the overall plan that's given to the entire Baháʼí world from the World center by the Universal House of Justice.
Why do we have conferences? You know, local, state, even international conferences? So the Baháʼís can come together and talk about how they are going to serve, how they are going to make their lives more useful in the furthering of the plans of local level, of the national level, and the international level. When a person leaves your community as a pioneer, he should go away with trumpets sounding. He should not cry. You should not cry to see him go. You should be very happy. And of course he is very happy. You should be very happy, because your community as a unit has increased the devotion and dedication in a single person, a member of that community, to the degree that he is ready to make even a greater sacrifice, leave his home and go to a different place to live, all for the cause of Bahá’u’lláh. In this country where you have so many opportunities to announce to the public through proclamation programs, by means of radio, television, newspapers, magazines, all kinds of instruments, all kinds, the media is open to us. We should have always something before the public, only to attract them to listen long enough so they can feel the spirit. Now we may get good enough in our presentations through the media that we can even convey the spirit of the Cause. When we do that, we have come a long ways. It is for us, really individually, face to face, talking with our friends, to give something of the spirit. But from what source does really the spirit come? Not from anything we say, not even from the love that we share. The spirit, the true spirit comes from the revealed word of the prophet. When you are able to have your contact at such a state that he or she is ready to read for him or herself the writings, that person then will feel the real spirit of the Cause. And sometimes it can be done suddenly.
In our Baháʼí lives, we have all kinds of prayers. We have prayers that asked for help for us to find seekers. We should use those so we would be guided to that one with the sparkle in his eye, so that we will be moved when we are called upon by our local assembly to do extension teaching in the next town or even to move to that town to help open a new locality or to increase the size of the group, or to form a Local Spiritual Assembly in another locality. We should be so inspired by our press and by what we have read by what Bahá’u’lláh says that we will be impelled to make the sacrifice to move and to go. I don't know now how many Local Assemblies you have in the Pioneer Valley, but really in my lifetime, I remember when there was not one. So if you're discouraged, you know, because, you know, you have been working very hard and you have been making every effort that you can think of, or been making strenuous efforts - because I don't think we ever make all complete effort, but you've been making effort you have not had what you call "success" because no one has said "oh, I want to sign a card", you should not be discouraged. Look at the progress in this area, but when you look at it, don't become smug and satisfied. Improve its quality. Increase that cohesion, that unity of purpose and increase the numbers of adherence to the Cause. In the message from the Universal House of Justice this year, there was a sentence that stated that the solution to the problems of the world will be a great expansion in the numbers, a great increase in the numbers of adherence to the Cause of Bahá’u’lláh.
Now, I understand from just conversations with pilgrims and with some of the Baháʼís in this area that there is now a certain, what shall I say, disappointment in the results that have occurred because of the great expansion, the increase in numbers that has occurred in some parts of the United States. Even in this area, some of you have expressed a feeling that we are increasing the numbers too rapidly and that we are really not increasing the number of real Baháʼís. This must have been something that was said to ‘Abdu’l-Bahá even in those days when you could count the Baháʼís by the thousands in the whole world, just in the thousands. Bahá’u’lláh-- I said in the days of Bahá’u’lláh, in the days of ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, and ‘Abdu’l-Bahá said the faith is like a garden whose gates are wide open. Some will look in and pass by. Some will come in and pass out, but some will come in and remain to be the gardeners, the tenders of that precious garden. Don't be concerned if in your experience, some of the very wonderful people that you teach the Baháʼí faith come in and pass on. You have done your part. They have been attracted. They must do their part. They must weather the test of belonging to a Baháʼí community - and there are tests. I mean, really, there are test. They must weather these tests and when they overcome these tests, they are better Baháʼís, they are stronger Baháʼís, but it's their duty then. Just because they come into the garden though, it doesn't mean that you should just leave them. You know? Not only should the individual feel a responsibility, the one who has taught this wonderful person, but the community itself should feel a responsibility to continue to water this fresh plant with the water of the love of God. This tender plant should not just be thrown out, you know, to fend for itself. A new Baháʼí requires a great deal of attention and love from the community, not only from the individual who has taught him or her. The community has a responsibility. They should not only feel and be invited to Baháʼí activities, but they should feel that, they should be made to feel and there should be a conscience conscious effort made to make them feel that they have a part to play, they have a contribution to make, they have a service to render in the community. But for goodness' sakes, don't overload them either, you know. Don't put him on all the committees, you know, right away, you know? There is a balance. There is a balance. But every individual has in this day of part to play in the Cause that he has accepted.
I remember once talking to a group of pilgrims and I asked them, "Why have you become Baháʼís?" And they began to tell me how they had become Baháʼís, you know. They said, "Well, I've been searching a long time, and this friend gave me a book and this book had some beautiful writings in it, and I found that they were true to me. And I was--" Many stories like this. In this group, there was a little girl about five years old. She was out on the end of her chair. He just could hardly wait that I got around to her, you know. [laughter] When I got to her, she sat forward with great energy. She said, "I'm a Baháʼí because Bahá’u’lláh loves me." [laughter] Which is the whole answer, you know. It is such a perfect answer. Now, Bahá’u’lláh loves all of the world. He says he has brought His faith to all of the peoples of the world, the kindreds and nations of the world. He loves more than just those who have accepted Him. He loves those who have not accepted Him. They are just not aware of it. All you have to do is to tell them "Bahá’u’lláh loves you". And if you are like this little girl, that's why she's a Baháʼí. I thought that was the most beautiful answer. Well that stopped my going around the room. I mean, that was the perfect answer and everybody agreed to it. What I'm saying is that there is in the hearts of people, this love of Bahá’u’lláh because He had spread it throughout the world. I mean, people have never heard the word. People have never even known that there is such a wonderful thing that exists, the Baháʼí Faith. They have an awakening in their hearts. We must go and turn it. They have a mirror, a beautiful mirror that Bahá’u’lláh has put there. We must just turn it to the light so that it was reflected and shine. All within the plan of your local community, all within the great plan of the National Assembly, all under the plan of the Universal House of Justice. And why must you be in tune with it? You know, with this with this particular Five Year Plan? Because there's going to be another one. There's going to be one for your children, for the little sweeties I see in this room. There'll be some plan for them because I don't think you're going to conquer the whole world. I don't think you're going to do it. I don't think this generation is going to make it. I don't think it's the plan of God. I think it is the plan of God that we must do our very best to awaken every soul that we possibly can.
Now I have been talking a lot and I haven't prefaced what I've said with one very important statement. And it just came to me because now I'm about to make a really, something I want you to know only comes from me. Everything I have said is only my own feeling. It's not from the House of Justice except that very first sentence where I said, "The Universal House of Justice extends to you its greeting." [laughter] Alright. Now, with that understood, I feel an urgency in the world. I feel that we must make a very great effort within this next five years, maybe within the next three years. I feel we're going to have - my only feeling - I feel we're going to have a great upheaval in the world. I don't know how we can continue to expect the nations, which are arming themselves to the teeth, not to fight. You know it's going to happen. And when it happens, it'll be a terrible conflict. We may be required as individual Baháʼís to be islands unto ourselves. We may not have a community to lean on. It may be gone. Maybe a few Baháʼís left in scattered areas. No telling what it may be. We know that at one time during World War II, the World Center was cut off from most of the world. You know that. This may happen again. You must be so in practice of making an effort every day of your lives so that without, perhaps without any guidance, you will continue. Maybe a Local Assembly will have to stand alone in a whole area where there were many, with a large community. I don't want to paint a picture of fear for you because it's only what I think, and maybe you are more optimistic and you don't see that this may happen, but I feel a terrible urgency. [to audience] Yes, please.
[audience member speaking] I just have a quote on my wall by ‘Abdu’l-Bahá that says whenever there's a thought of war, substitute immediately with the thought of peace, so. [audience reacting]
Yes, yes. Alright. This is the peace [laughter]. In this time, in this time, today and tomorrow and as far as we can see peace, let us use it. Let us use it with all of our energy, with all of our intellect, with all of our spirit to further the purposes, the aims, the teachings of Bahá’u’lláh and attract to His great fold as many [?] as we possibly can. Without a knowledge of the vision of what Bahá’u’lláh sees for the future of the world and the beautiful statement that the Guardian makes about the future of the world, I don't know how other people can stand to live in the society that exists. We must give them the hope that we have. We must give them this vision.
Now, I'd like to tell you a few things about the World Center. Many of you have been pilgrims, so you can add to what I'm going to say. You know, when you come on pilgrimage, many of you will be very happy to see friends that you have seen. And once a pilgrim said to the Guardian, "Oh, I'm so happy to be here just to meet you." And Shoghi Effendi said, "You haven't come to meet me. You haven't come to meet any individual at the World Center. You have come to pray in the Holy Shrine." Another instance, the Guardian had recited the Tablet of the Visitation in the shrine, and he had bowed to the threshold and he was walking backwards to the Shrine, and of course, some of the pilgrims, you know, out of deference to him, they turned to him. And as they turn, they turned their backs to the threshold of the Shrine of the Báb. When the Guardian came out, he said to Rúhíyyih Khánum, you must tell them that they should never turn their backs to this holy spot. Rúhíyyih Khánum says that this is figuratively also, we must never turn our backs to the teachings. And Bahá’u’lláh says in His teachings, teach the Cause of God. In the gleanings and so many quotations, He calls upon us to teach. He calls upon us to teach like it is the very breath of life itself. And then in one place, He says if you cannot go yourself, send another in your stead. Out of the great love He had, He's shown us that if you cannot [?], maybe the force of circumstances in your lives, if you cannot teach yourself, then send another. That is encourage someone, deputize someone to go in your stead. I'll tell you a little story - I was gonna tell you about the World Center. We cannot teach there. So there are 19 of us who have selected people to write to, each one of us, to teach them the Faith by mail. And we call these that we have selected our targets. [laughter] ["] Let's send a missile to them. And we pray for them together, and we pool what little we saw as we have and we support to home from pioneers in Argentina.
You know, just the action, the unity of action in those 19 people is so inspirational. No, we come together. We're very excited about it. You know? How wonderful opportunity you have to teach right here without having to do it all by remote control [laughing] by writing letters. You can come together every week, and suddenly every 19 days, and talk about what has happened in your teaching efforts. You don't know what this is. [?] So do you have any questions? Yes.
[woman speaking] Do you think that if a Jew in Israel heard about the Faith and wanted to become a Baháʼí, they couldn't?
They'd have to leave.
[woman speaking] Really?
Yes.
[woman speaking] Is that for political reasons and is it going to change?
In Israel, everyone is registered with the Department-- with the Ministry of Interior, according to his religion. And it's a big problem to change your religion. A Jew can't become a Christian, a Christian can't become a Jew. A Muslim can't change. And none of them can become Baháʼís, and a Baháʼí can't change. It is a very difficult thing. But now, once in a while-- and I mean I know of one case that was celebrated in the paper. There was a Christian-- there was a monk who was there and he wanted to become a Jew. And he had a difficult time and he finally was accepted in some way. You know, he became a Jew.
[woman speaking] It's very hard to become a Jew, anyway.
If you're not born a Jew. Exactly. They'd rather not. So it was very difficult for that reason and also because of the law.
[woman speaking] But is that a temporary political condition or is it liable to stay that way?
It must be temporary. [laughter] No, I mean [laughs] it must be temporary because Bahá’u’lláh says that the Faith is for all the world, but also the Guardian said to a number of pilgrims, on Pilgrims' notes, he said that these people will become Baháʼís and they would be wonderful Baháʼís because they already have a knowledge of the laws of God and they loved them. You know? He said that, he indicated that sometime in the future. Now, when that happened, that would be, I guess, when the House of Justice decides when it's time to teach, but I guess it will come. Maybe at a time when enough Jews are asking. And probably they will be told, "Will you go ask your rabbi if you can become a Baháʼí?"
[woman speaking] May I ask you a question? My family has a friend left in Cuba. And there were sisters and brothers, and there were - my [?] and sister were little. They grew up together. And I received a letter from him and he knew him since I was born, of course. And I wrote him back and I signed "With Baháʼí love." Well, he rolled back. He was just so elated. He was so happy to hear from me again, and also to see this Baháʼí love because he had heard through the vine something and he didn't know exactly what about the Baháʼí Faith, but he knew it was good and he wanted to hear something more about it, you know? And I started writing a letter telling him that I had become Baháʼí and why and all that, you know. And then someone told me in the community in [?] that I should not try to teach the Faith by mail. Well, if he had asked me, I haven't. I tore the letter because I didn't want to do anything that wasn't right, but at the same time, I felt so bad because I almost felt as though I had let him down. There he was, a man hearing his--
Listen, every Riḍván, we received a cable from Cuba to say that they have had a successful national convention and they have elected so and so in the National Assembly. Now we don't hear anything during the year, very little communication between the world center in Cuba during the year. But in Riḍván, we get a notice, a cable that they have elected a National Spiritual Assembly. We invite them to come to the international convention. No one has come yet, but they continue to send the invitations. Now, I don't know whether it's safe for you to write to your friend or not, but I would write and not say so much about the Baháʼí Faith. Write just as a friend and let him tell you, let him ask the questions. He should be wise enough to, as to what the situation is, where he is. And it may be different in different parts of Cuba. Maybe in some of the big cities, they're very tight, very tight on security. Maybe in other places there wouldn't be a problem. When I ask you, when he writes to you, when he said to you, "I was very happy to see the word Baháʼí." Did he say this? Baháʼí.
[woman speaking] Yes.
Was it censored? was it clipped out?
[woman speaking] No, it was not. It was unusual because some of the letters don't get there.
So, write. So, write and see but write in a wise way, you know. Not like you can go write out here. Not write out in the street, you know, and say, "Listen, Bahá’u’lláh is coming." Be careful, but write. Yes?
[man speaking] I wonder if you can tell us a bit about the progress of the building of the seat of the House of Justice maybe in terms of a schedule, a timeline, the first construction, and how the funds are doing, and how it [?]?
Alright. The excavations are complete because the mayor of the city of Haifa allowed us to begin excavating even before we had a building permit. To get a building permit in Israel for such a large undertaking is quite a deal, you know. There's so many things. This is almost in hand, but the excavations are complete. You read in the cable that the Universal House of Justice had signed the contract for the marble from Italy. And on my way home, I will visit the marble factory. I want to see. I understand by the end of July, the first column will be complete and we'll have real pictures of it, and you can see. Now there is a delay in -- you know, we have Mr. Hussein [?], the architect in Persia, has an English firm of engineers to make the specifications for everything. Those people are slow. No, maybe they are thorough and that's why. [laughter] Anyhow, we don't have from them yet the specifications so that we can let them on attendance for the bids. We are planning possibly to use an Israeli firm for the shell of the building - no, to the concrete superstructure. We are planning to probably use a French firm to attach the marble plates to the building and to set up the columns, and the marble would be Italian, carved from Greece. [laughter] It is the same marble that the Parthenon is built of, this pentelical marble, which has stood the test of time. You know, we are building for 500 - well, maybe a thousand years, at least for the dispensation. And the steel, the structure of steel and so forth will be given, will be coming from Europe. I think that we are very close to signing a contract for supply in Luxembourg for steel. I don't think Mr. [?] has decided yet on the roofing tile company, you know. I don't know whether he used the same company in Holland on that, but I'm going to that company because there are some defects. Some - Juan remembers - cracks in the roof of, the tile in the roof of the archives building but I want to find out why and I want to find out what we can do about it. I'm going to go by and see them. The other consultants, you know, for sanitation and water supply have finished their work. The consultants for the electrical systems are almost finished and the air-conditioning and heating and all of this, this is an Israeli firm, and this man has all of his work ready up to the point of putting it in the superstructure so he has to wait for those from the English front. [laughter]
You asked about a time. Now, I am not as optimistic as some of my co-workers. See, they think that in about four years, the building would be complete. I think if the House of Justice moves into the building in six years, we will be very fortunate because there's always some delays. And if you have a shipping strike in Italy, all right, so you have, and even in Israel, there're all kind of strikes. You get the stuff right to the ship, and you can't get it unloaded. You call it a [?]. So I think all in all, if we can move in six years, we will have been very lucky. In the meantime, we are increasing, you know-- the pace of the work throughout the world is increasing to such a degree that we have to increase our staff at the World Center. And as we increase the staff, we have to move into other buildings. One example, I think when one was in the Holy Land, the audio-visual department was right in number ten, the office of the Universal House of Justice. Now it's about two blocks away in another building. We have Department of Finance, was in one end of the building. Now it's in another building altogether. So for that time we'll have to move out and rent or buy flats and [?]. But even this building, say, even this building 100 years from now will not be able to house all the functions of the World Center. We will have other buildings, even for the central administration. And you know that on the art where the building will be constructed, there are to be three other major structures. One will be the library at the object into the Arc from the archives building, the archives on the west and the Arc [?] will be the library. Universal House of Justice is at the top of the Arc, or at the center of the Arc. And on either side of that building and between the library and the archives building will be a building for the study of the text, what we call now the research department, really. And the other building will be the International Teaching Center. And this will be the principal buildings on the Arc that you read about, you know, in the prophecy of Isaiah where he says God will sail his arc on my [?]. The Guardian said that this is the area, because the word is a different word that arc and that is like a ship. This is an arc like a part of a circle. It's a different word, but the Guardian said that this is the area. This is the meaning of that prophecy. So with the building of the House of Justice, we would have completed the central building and the most important building because the House of Justice itself is now the center to which all Baháʼís what must turn in the Faith. It is the head of the Faith.
Now you ask about finances. That's a very good question. [laughter] In the Baháʼí world today, the book of the international finances comes from the United States and Persia. I hope the United States, the Baháʼís in the United States don't permit the Persians to contribute all for this building. They have already contributed a great deal. We have enough money for two years work before we've started, and we have pledges for about twice that much more. And of course, communities and individuals and the National Spiritual Assembly of the United States are making regular contributions. And most of the National Assemblies throughout the world make a token contribution annually toward this. But I suppose you're asking so you'll know how much is it. I estimated the building would cost, well, more than $15,000,000. And I know that there are Baháʼís in the world who might think that that is a tremendous amount of money to put in a building, and they may have some problem with this, you know, because there's so many other things you could do to help mankind with $15,000,000. And there are. But we are building the centerpiece for the Cause of God. It should be an inspiration to people to see, not only to Baháʼís. It should be an inspiration for people to see, like the Shrine of the Báb is, to nonBaháʼís who visit Israel, so that they will be attracted - and unfortunate, some people are attracted even by buildings. They will be attracted to the beauty of the Faith because it's a beautiful building, and it would also be of service, but also be of service. Now everything I'm saying, as I said and I'd say again, is only from Amoz Gibson. It's not from the House of Justice. What the House of Justice wants you to hear and to know and to see, they write because it's on [?]. Yes?
[man speaking] Could you please say something about how the Universal House of Justice establishes the authenticity of the sacred texts and preserves the viability of the texts?
Yes. We have continued to ask from the National Spiritual Assemblies, from Local Spiritual Assemblies and individuals, we have asked them to send to the World Centre copies, or the originals if they want to part with them and we will return to them copies, of all of the letters and Tablets that they have received from Bahá’u’lláh, from ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, or from Shoghi Effendi so that we will have a complete record of the original text because sometimes a very important part of the text isn't a tablet to an individual from Bahá’u’lláh. We will have a complete record of the interpretations from ‘Abdu’l-Bahá or from Shoghi Effendi. We have a difficult question. One on which we have not had the same, almost the same type of question before and we haven't established a policy. We go to the text. You asked, "How do we establish the authenticity?" There are a few people left like Mr. Samandari, who can recognize with absolute certainty the handwriting ‘Abdu’l-Bahá and Bahá’u’lláh. Shoghi Effendi signed everything and we are certain of his tablets and his letters. When we are not certain-- and sometimes we have something that people have sent for a long time, maybe from ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, but a part of it had been destroyed so there's no signature. When we are not certain, we don't accept it. I have a compilation upstairs that will come. I'm reading it because it's so interesting. It's on the education of children and it will be sent to the National Spiritual Assemblies and they will do with it, you know, what they will [?]. Maybe US would publish it. But in addition to that that is authenticated, that that we know has come from Bahá’u’lláh, ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, even from the Báb, and, of course, from Shoghi Effendi, there is another stack like this that is attributed to ‘Abdu’l-Bahá. even had been published in some of the older publications like the Stars of the West but we can't find the original. We don't have the original, so we can't say that this is from ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, and we won't say that. Does that help you with your question?
[man speaking] Thank you. Yes.
Yes?
[man speaking] One of the very unique features of the Baháʼí Faith is the promise of infallibility to the House of Justice and I was wondering if it's possible for you to say anything about how that infallibility is demonstrated in this world [unintelligible]. [laughter]
I remember, you know-- do you remember the Hand of the Cause Leroy Ioas. When the House of Justice was, I don't think we'd all even yet settled in the Holy Land, but he was very interested in this question of infallibility. He even told me once that he asked the Guardian how did this work, and the Guardian said that-- it's very difficult for me to explain it to you. Now, the Guardian had it within himself in a person, he says, "Not everything that I say is infallible, not even everything that I write. But when I answer an important question, when I interpret what Bahá’u’lláh has said, when I say that Bahá’u’lláh says the meaning of this is so and so, when I write that, I know it." Now, so he said, "The Hand of the Cause to go ask me, 'How does this work?'" He said, "How do you feel?" I said, "Well, you know, I don't have the say." [laughter] Actually none of us nine men have this in ourselves, but when we come to a decision, a very important decision and one of the most important decisions that I remember and it was one of the early ones, when the House of Justice said that it could not appoint nor could it see any way that it could appoint nor could it legislate to appoint a Guardian, we met on that question for two weeks. And it was such an important question. We went to the Mansion of Bahá’u’lláh. We met in the Great Hall. Those of you who have been on pilgrimage, you know how it's constructed. There's great center hall. We met in this great center hall, and we talked over this question many times because it's very clear it seems in the text that the Faith must have a Guardian. Well, it had had a Guardian. It had this institution. But, you know, we were conditioned that it would be continuous. When we made this decision, there was a surety. I felt it within myself that this was it, you know. And of course I didn't ask like you did. I didn't ask him and the other members, "Well, how did you feel?" [laughter] So I don't know how they felt, but I felt that they felt the same way I did. I don't know that they felt that way. And I don't think I would ever go back and ask them, but maybe I might, you know. [laughter] But I remember when we left that Mansion at the end of that two weeks, that we felt that this was the correct and this was that infallibility. But in general, all we have done, we have been legislated. We have created one institution, the International Teaching Center. Well, really we have created two institutions, the Institution of the Counsellors before that, and the actual body that in the Holy Land, the International Teaching Center. And every day I am more convinced of the value and of the need and of the brilliant results of these counsellors and of this institution, the International Teaching Center. It's a way of extending into the future the functions that were bestowed upon the Hands of the Cause, the functions of propagation and protection.
[woman speaking] How do you [?] since, you know, being on House is a sort of a [?] epitomy of the answer. I mean, your experience as a member of the House would epitomize the answer that it works. But the question works up from the bottom and down of the top. We, all of us, feel inadequate. And whether it's as an individual teacher, whether as a member of a local assembly, whether as a member of a national assembly, and sure the individual members of the House of Justice, especially the first time around, until you get, you know, more or less used to what this responsibility meant and how it could be handled. Must have felt incredibly [?] responsibility. Maybe you could talk to us from your experience of how whether it's faith, whether it's the setting aside feelings of inadequacy, what it is that help one get past that point and trusting God that one would do what one's supposed to do on whatever role.
Okay, you've asked me a very personal question so I will give you very personal answer, okay? When I was a boy, I still walked to the fields with my father. And well, we were kind of pulling and he walked a long ways and he walked very fast and I would run to keep up with him. But I would question him all the way about different things about the Faith because that's all really he knew to talk about was your faith. I mean you couldn't talk to him about anything but your faith. If the weather was was good, yes, Bahá’u’lláh sends good weather. But he used to talk, he used to talk to me about the Universal House of Justice like it was such a grand institution that I couldn't see how it would come into existence for maybe three centuries. Never did I expect to see it exist even in my lifetime. And suddenly, you know, I never expected to be on it. Now, you say, how do I have the confidence? You know me very well. You know I don't have a lot of confidence in myself. I have a lot of confidence in those other eight men. Really, I do. And the more I work with them, the more confidence I have. So I think they can carry me along. [laughter] Really!
[woman speaking] I wasn't trying to put you on the spot. [laughter]
No, no, you're not putting me on the spot. No.
[woman speaking] I asked because I think we all have these feelings at one time or another. God knows, you know.
Oh yes, I can remember. I used to be so shy. I remember at a feast once, they used to pass out the reading at the feast at the last minute which just always seems get me in ham because I want to read them several times beforehand so I can read it to my ability, you know. So the person who was in charge of these gave me the book just that night and I said, "Oh, I don't have my glasses." I didn't want to read it, you see. My glasses are right in my pocket. I went home feeling terrible. And I decided after that, whatever I was called upon to do for the Cause of Bahá’u’lláh, I would try to do to my best ability. And thus I have lived that way the rest of my life. I still don't have any confidence in anything [laughter] but I try.
[man speaking] You have said that you may not have supreme confidence in yourself, but you have confidence in the eight other men and I was wondering if you told the eight other men [laughter] if they would say the same thing and [?].
The next time-- you know, Dr. Hugh very well. The next time you see ask him. [laughter] See what he says. I don't know.
When you're teaching anybody, teaching the faith, again the same thing comes up. Feeling [?] out of it, having to work [?] in the old world order and you're trying to tell somebody what it's like and what you believe and there are basics that people say, "Yeah, I'd like to see that happen, too, but you're being idealistic. You're being unrealistic. You're a dreamer or you're romantic." And then they say, "Well, you're not perfect either." And you know, that just blows me away because if I'm not perfect, well, they're not perfect either. But I'm not saying, you're saying, "Look at me, I'm perfect." I'm saying, "Look at me. I'm trying to make myself better. I'm trying to change me. I'm trying to work within a system that has dragged so many people down and killed so many people just out of desperation with [?] itself into taking their own lives but I'm trying to work within this system to change it." It's just, it's such a hassle trying, you know, and they, you know, put this on you. And they said [?] cite other examples. They look at the people, in other words, and not looking at the beliefs. And you sit there and you say to them, "Well look at the Christian friends you have, the Muslim friends you have, the people that go to church on Sundays." They just go to church and, you know, go to synagogue and Friday night services and Saturday morning, and that's it, you know. And then they sit there in their businesses and in their lives, they cheat and they lie. They steal from each other. They backstab and do whatever they feel is necessary to make their life profitable in this world.
When they say to you "you're not perfect", you say, "No because if I was perfect, I wouldn't have to be a Baháʼí. I wouldn't be here." [laughter] The whole purpose of this life is to begin the perfection of your soul, to begin it. You know? Because the human soul begins here. It begins its growth here. You started on that path by the qualities that you give to it, to your effort in living according to the teachings of God for this day. And that soul continues to progress even after it separated from this body, even before it attains the perfection that it is destined to reach. There has never been a perfect Baháʼí, never. ‘Abdu’l-Bahá was the Perfect Exemplar, and He was only one. Even this title wasn't bestowed upon the Guardian, as perfect as he was. Some people ask you, you know, you're not perfect. Of course we are not perfect. And the degrees of perfection, I mean, today you're more perfect than you were yesterday. Everyone should be, you know. And tomorrow more so. But this is always relative. This is in the teachings. It's not this absolute, in any case, in the material existence on this earth. It's all relative. No, I hope that doesn't make anybody decide, "Well, I'm not going to work at it so hard [some laughter] because relatively I'm better than I was yesterday." You should be your best every day, and every day should be better than yesterday.
[woman speaking] This is in the writings that you can never attain perfection but you should continually strive for it.
Strive for it. Yes?
[man speaking] Being at the World Center and, you know, being involved in the plan at this time. Do you see personally a working towards collective unity of the worldwide community as reflected through the national communities and the local communities?
Yes. You know, it's marvelous to see, for example, because the Holy Land is closer to Persia than it is to the West. A number of young Persian men and women, and more women than men, who go out as pioneers, single, alone and lonely. And they go to other countries because they say that they must take the Faith of their native land to the world. You have seen them, yes, in Liberia.
[man speaking] [?] two days ago, [?].
And in Persia, any educated person can become wealthy. Really? There is such a need for people with any kind of skill at all, and the salaries are fantastic. It is a very great sacrifice that they make, and they go. I think this is a kind of international cooperation. And of course, they're coming from United States. You go anywhere in the world, you find Americans and Persian, but more recently the number of young people coming from Europe to go to other parts of the world - now I am sure that the other parts of the world will pay Persia back. They will go to Persia and they will come to the United States and they will come to Europe. [?] [laughter]. You have the Indians now going to other countries, right? [?] He has come from. You know, [?] was a counselor in India and he was really terrific. So he was very knowledgeable about the Faith. And I'm sure he's been a bounty to your community. If he hasn't, you must call him more because he can be. Does that answer somewhat?
[man speaking] No. [laughter]
No. I didn't see the gleam in your eyes so I thought you--.
[man speaking] I would like to know the feeling of the people at the World Center as to the feeling of world unity of the Baháʼí community? Is there a need for every one of us as individuals Baháʼís in any land that we're in to strive, to learn to strive maybe more than we have to learn to live collectively and to unify our communities to sustain any kind of a world crisis as the Baháʼí community of the world? And what I would like to know is do you feel from the beginning of the Five Year Plan until now any move of the world community towards this goal to sustain, to be able to sustain, I mean, every year, getting more together?
No, I don't believe that-- I believe this: that the Baháʼí world community would suffer a great deal without a connection to the World Center. I don't believe that there is developed, even in the most advanced Baháʼí community, enough cohesion to stand alone. And that's why I feel an urgency about our work, about our work of consolidation. This is really what you're talking about, increasing the unity in the community and of course, about our work toward expanding the Faith, increasing these numbers. I feel that the National Assemblies and the national communities depend a great deal on guidance from the World Center. And sometimes I think they depend too much on it. I feel sometimes they are afraid to be bold and move on their own for fear they will make a mistake. Well, better to make a mistake than stand still because that is even a greater mistake, you know, and move forward with a boldness, with a sensible boldness, knowing that if you make a mistake, all right, then you'll start in another direction if you were told that this is wrong, you know. But to stand and wait to be told everything is too much like a very small child. I mean, I don't know whether even the small children will wait if you tell them. [laughter] If I understand your question, I don't think that the Baháʼí world, but it will reach this.
[man speaking] Yes. That was my question.
Yeah. I think you have a very good National Assembly here in the United States. I can't say that-- and I think the National Assembly here has a lot of initiative, and I think that's very good but I can't say that that exists everywhere. There are others, but there are many, many others that are just absolutely dependent on guidance and urging and pushing. Excuse me. I know that the biscuits are getting stale. [laughter]
[man speaking] You shared with us the-- [audio cuts off]
You know, I was so excited about being able to come out not into the world where I could do some teaching. And of course to see my fellow Baháʼís and be inspired by them and to receive great love from them and to bring to them the love of the Universal House of Justice. I was inspired by all of it, but also I thought maybe I might be able to do a little teaching work. So I did a lot of praying about it so, you know, I would have the opportunity. In Paris, the plane filled up and beside me sat a very tall man. I thought he was a basketball player, and I guess we had been, you know, hardly the seatbelt light had gone off. And he turned to me and said, "My name is Norman and I want to talk about religion. Is it all right?" [loud laughter and applause] Fantastic, really. Really out of the blue! We had seven hours together. And of course, it's a very tiring trip, but in between naps, we got a lot of talking. [laughter]
Finally, you know, he said to me, he said, "You know, I don't find anything wrong with what you say. I can accept everything that you say. But what I want to tell you, I'm a Methodist." [mixed reactions]
So I said, "That's wonderful, you know, because you believe in God."
"Oh yes. I don't accept everything they say. And when I'd joined the Church, I told them I didn't accept everything [laughter] they say and if they wanted me in, then all right. My wife want me to join and I was ready to join." He said, "But I am so glad I had the opportunity to talk to you."
I said, "Well, listen, you really haven't gotten anything from me about the Faith. What you need to feel is the spirit. You need to read the actual words of the Manifestation of God."
He said, "But you told me they were in Arabic and Persian." I said, "But they were translated by the interpreter, the appointed interpreter." I had told him about the Guardian and ‘Abdu’l-Bahá, you know, so he knew that I was talking about one of them. He said, "Which one?" [laughter] I said Shoghi Effendi. He said, "Oh, so that's very recent."
I said, "Yes, that's very recent." I mean, in a sense, very recent translation. I said, "I'm going to send you a book."
"Oh, please do that." And gave me the address. I'm going to send him Gleanings. I don't know whether I'd been moved to ever give an [?] readings, you know, [laughter] but this is the way I felt and I'm going to send it to him. He lives in a little place called [?] Falls, New York. I don't know. It's upstate, up from New York City. He is an IBM expert.
